Picscout anyone?

[sheila]

I have recently joined this site (although yet to subscribe)

http://www.picscout.com/home/photograph ... 47&type=10

As theft is endemic on both PBase and others, I thought this would be a handy membership! Does anyone else use this tracking system for illegal use of images on websites?

Cheers
Sheila

[castledude]

I guess it would depend on how many images and how much I thought I could get from them. The 50% fee seems kinda high and could easily hit the amounts that a Digimarc Pro account costs.

[photomary]

I noticed at the end of the FAQ it says to click here to see a list of customers but the link is not there.

Also, I thought that if you really want to have a leg to stand on if you say an image is yours is that you need to register your images as copyrighted by you, which costs money, and most photographers (those not full-time especially) don't want to spend the time and money to do that. The person using your image on their website can simply say, show me the paper which says it is legally copyrighted as yours. If you can't produce it, then too bad for you. Or, they just say, Okay, I'll take it off my website, but I'm not paying you anything. I'm sure the photographers on Corbis all have paid to register their copyrighted images.

I'd like to hear from someone who actually uses such a site and has actually gotten money and how much they got, before I'd even consider spending 14.95/month.

[sheila]

I guess it would depend on how many images and how much I thought I could get from them. The 50% fee seems kinda high and could easily hit the amounts that a Digimarc Pro account costs.

I agree the fee is somewhat high but 50% of something is better than 100% of nothing! Even if you Digimarc your images, you still have to find them being illegally used. I am also told that Digimarcing is not foolproof in that the watermark can be removed just by performing a simple edit to the image. A couple of years back I contacted Digimarc regarding this problem and they said then they were working on it!

Sheila

[sheila]

I noticed at the end of the FAQ it says to click here to see a list of customers but the link is not there.

Also, I thought that if you really want to have a leg to stand on if you say an image is yours is that you need to register your images as copyrighted by you, which costs money, and most photographers (those not full-time especially) don't want to spend the time and money to do that. The person using your image on their website can simply say, show me the paper which says it is legally copyrighted as yours. If you can't produce it, then too bad for you. Or, they just say, Okay, I'll take it off my website, but I'm not paying you anything. I'm sure the photographers on Corbis all have paid to register their copyrighted images.

I'd like to hear from someone who actually uses such a site and has actually gotten money and how much they got, before I'd even consider spending 14.95/month.

With respect, you don't need a paper to say that the image is yours. The US is one of the few countries where one has to register copyright. There is no such registration here in Australia. Once you take the photograph, you own the copyright. If you can prove you hold the original high res (and/or RAW) image, then I would think you would have a case. I might add that I am in the process of registering my images with the US Copyright Office, the registration fee for which I understand is US$45.00.

Cheers
Sheila

[castledude]

I agree the fee is somewhat high but 50% of something is better than 100% of nothing!

Yea but like I said it's up to you to decide if 50% fees are going to eclipse the larger digimarc fee.

Even if you Digimarc your images, you still have to find them being illegally used. Sheila

Actually that's why I specifically referenced the Pro version they do a service similar to picscount and do a spider search with reports. You can't remove the embedded version just by editing without significant editing.


Also BTW American law doesn't require you register the copyright. You create it it's your copyright. The registration process is just to provide a government sanctioned proof of ownership and make proof of ownership a lot easier.

Copyright occurs automatically when both of two conditions are satisfied:
the creation of an original work and
"fixation of that work in any tangible medium of expression."
17 USC §§ 101, 102(a), 302(a).

[dougj]

Good find Sheila, it'll be very interesting to learn your experiences with this service.

[sheila]

I guess it would depend on how many images and how much I thought I could get from them. The 50% fee seems kinda high and could easily hit the amounts that a Digimarc Pro account costs.

Any idea how much the Digimarc Pro account is. Do they charge by the image or what? I have gone to their site but there is no pricing info. I have filled out a request but in the meantime, do you have a ballpark figure. I know in the past when I looked into this, I found it just too expensive. Maybe things have changed

I was also under the impression that if you registered with the US copyright, you could obtain general damages rather than just the loss of the fee that they would have paid to buy the image in the first place. Maybe I am wrong...I was once ..involved my first marriage
Cheers and thanks for the input, castledude.
Sheila

[castledude]

Full deails here http://www.digimarc.com/mypicturemarc/

Summary 5000 pictures/$499 (USD) per year.


First off INAL (but this is what one told me).

What you are saying used to be true but the Digital Millenium Copyright Act of 1998 gave us in the US the restoration of copyright protection of the WTO. Our copyright protection had been wittled down so it was pretty easy to not protect and lose the protection. This is one of the good things of the DMCA.

Foreigners are now offered the same protction (under section 104) of copyright protection if they are registered in their home country. You are not required to register here because we are friends (with treaties).

I didn't say I wouldn't send in the pictures for protection. It just isn't absolutely required.

[dougj]

I'm not an attorney, but here is an extract from the US copyright law.

"Copyright Registration

In general, copyright registration is a legal formality intended to make a public record of the basic facts of a particular copyright. However, registration is not a condition of copyright protection. Even though registration is not a requirement for protection, the copyright law provides several inducements or advantages to encourage copyright owners to make registration. Among these advantages are the following:

* Registration establishes a public record of the copyright claim.

* Before an infringement suit may be filed in court, registration is necessary for works of U.S. origin.

* If made before or within 5 years of publication, registration will establish prima facie evidence in court of the validity of the copyright and of the facts stated in the certificate.

* If registration is made within 3 months after publication of the work or prior to an infringement of the work, statutory damages and attorney's fees will be available to the copyright owner in court actions. Otherwise, only an award of actual damages and profits is available to the copyright owner.

* Registration allows the owner of the copyright to record the registration with the U. S. Customs Service for protection against the importation of infringing copies. For additional information, go to the U.S. Customs and Border Protection website at http://www.cbp.gov/xp/cgov/import. Click on “Intellectual Property Rights.â€

[sheila]

Foreigners are now offered the same protction (under section 104) of copyright protection if they are registered in their home country. You are not required to register here because we are friends (with treaties).

I

Unfortunately, there is nowhere to register copyright here in Australia.

Sheila

[sheila]

While on the subject of registering (and I am slightly digressing here ), is it possible to use PBaseGrab (if it still exists) to send to the Copyright Office via the Web.

Cheers
Sheila

[dougj]

While on the subject of registering (and I am slightly digressing here ), is it possible to use PBaseGrab (if it still exists) to send to the Copyright Office via the Web.

There doesn't appear to be a way to accommodate this:

"UPLOADING MULTIPLE OR LARGE FILES The ‘browse and select’ window enables you to upload files individually. If you have a large number of files, we recommend that you create and upload one ZIP file. However, eCO has a 30-minute upload time out, which, along with your connection speed, limits the maximum file size that can be uploaded in one session. See the table below for guidance on how many files can be zipped and uploaded in one session.

Q&A

Network Connection
Max. File Size
How Many Files Can I Zip?
Typical Modem (56 kbps)
11.3 MB

6 high quality (low compression) JPEGs taken with a 5MP camera

3 three-minute standard (128 kbps bitrate) MP3 files

Fiber Optic Cable (2 mbps)
405 MB

220 high quality (low compression) JPEGs taken with a 5MP camera

135 three-minute standard (128 kbps bitrate) MP3 files

Also, there are no established guidelines on required or recommended file types, image resolution or size, MP3 file bit rate, etc. A file is acceptable so long as Copyright Office staff can open, view and/or hear it clearly."

http://www.copyright.gov/eco/tips.pdf

[sheila]

Thanks Doug. Wouldn't it be nice and easy if we could just send the link of our PBase site galleries to the US Copyright Office for their record of our work. Too simple I guess!

Cheers
Sheila

[dougj]

Hi Sheila, you're right, that would be nice and easy. I'm reminded that this is the government and expectations should be set accordingly LOL.

Anyway, I'm interested in learning your experiences with Picscout. I suppose we might be able to use PBgrab, sort through the small or medium versions of the images and upload the ones of interest.

I haven't used PBgrab in awhile, but I assume it still works OK. IIRC, it downloaded all of the image sizes available.....?