used Canon 20D, scratches

[quantbits]

I bought an " E- " 20D from Adorama, and I found scratches on the mirror (I think?)
Technically don't have the grounds to return it, I know - no need for a lecture.

E+=Excellent + Very clean
E = Excellent Shows normal wear, might have minor scratches, glass clean.
E - = Excellent - Average wear, may have small marks but no brassing
V = Very Good Shows heavier wear, works mechanically fine
G = Good Shows extra heavy use wear, glass might have scratches, usable

In any case, this is how bad the mirror is.
http://shinjixikari.com/misc/20d.jpg - dots shot up F10+ & w/pop-up & 550EX
(red are dust, I wiped with microfiber/sprayed with air)

1)Is there a way to replace the mirror for cheap at a shop?
2)I'll definetely try to argue to return it, but am I seriously going to win?

Yes, this will be the last time I'm buying used - I've learned my lesson.
Thanks for all your responses.

[dougj]

The mirror flips up when the shutter opens to expose the sensor. Dust, scratches, etc. on the mirror that you might see through the viewfinder won't appear in the photo. Photos shot with small apertures against a light background will highlight dust and scratches on the filter that covers the sensor, which is what I think you have. The ones you have circled are a bit worrisome, with any luck they're just fibers sitting on the sensor. You can try cleaning the sensor and the rear element of the lens.

Sensor cleaning is a little more complex than lens cleaning, requiring more caution and different material. If you have experience cleaning sensors, go for it. I blow the sensor with a hand operated squeeze blower and then use the Copper Hill method, there are other methods that work as well. Avoid canned air and touching the sensor surface with anything that is not specifically designed for sensor cleaning, the same with cleaning liquids.

You could send an email with the photo to Jerry Davis at Adorama (jerryg@adorama.com), he's one of the supervisors and is helpful in resolving customer problems. Maybe they'll reimburse you for a cleaning by Canon service, it's worth sending an email and asking him.

[quantbits]

Sensor cleaning is a little more complex than lens cleaning, requiring more caution and different material. If you have experience cleaning sensors, go for it. I blow the sensor with a hand operated squeeze blower and then use the Copper Hill method, there are other methods that work as well. Avoid canned air and touching the sensor surface with anything that is not specifically designed for sensor cleaning, the same with cleaning liquids.

not that I am too lazy to clean the camera(heck, I already tried), but judging by the E- condition, should I be obligated to clean it - or even expect it'll be dirty with the description?

[dougj]

not that I am too lazy to clean the camera(heck, I already tried), but judging by the E- condition, should I be obligated to clean it - or even expect it'll be dirty with the description?

I agree, they should have cleaned the sensor and mirror as needed. Adorama probably checked the camera and sensor before they bought it, and should have identified a dirty sensor then. The question is what do you do now? I see only 3 remedies - have Adorama take care of it, have it cleaned by Canon or a local shop, or clean the sensor yourself. I still think it's worth contacting Adorama. If some of the stuff on the sensor is new, you could explain that (the mirror ?) was dirty when it arrived and you already attempted to clean it but it looks like the sensor is dirty.

One of the unfortunate complications of DSLRs is sensor dust, depending on shooting & handling conditions eventually the sensor collects dust and needs to be cleaned periodically. Some folks prefer to have the manufacturer or a camera shop clean it, some do it themselves.

BTW, the mirror has the partial reflective coating on the front surface and it's fairly delicate. Many folks recommend doing nothing more than gently blowing on the mirror to remove dust. This also avoids potential damage to the shutter, which is over the sensor when the mirror is in the down position.

I don't know if any of this helps, best of luck in getting it resolved.

[quantbits]

they already got back to me offering a replacement. I am currently negotiating for a total refund as I see a $760 EOS 30D new on Amazon.

Thanks for your help.

[dougj]

That's a good price, I paid a lot more than that for my 30D. Amazon has a number of 'affiliates' that actually sell & ship the photography equipment for them, I understand that many of them are good companies to work with. Good luck, I hope it works out well for you.

[helenoster]

Thanks for the welcome Doug; BTW, if you ever note an Adorama customer with a problem that I don't apear to be responding to (some inevitably slip through as I'm visiting close on 300 photo sites, blogs etc), feel free to pass on my contact details: helen.oster@adoramacamera.com

Helen Oster
Adorama Camera Customer Service Ambassador